December 2025. Rye Harbour.
Back in Rye from Waterbeach last Sunday, stunned at the news that Peter had died, I spent the next day writing about Mudgie and reading tributes to the man. Mrs RM had enjoyed his company on his last Proper Day Out in Atherstone and was equally shocked.
Everyone seemed to be heading out for a pint of Boring Brown Bitter, and with foul weather afoot I picked the closest pub,
the William the Conqueror at least open that Monday lunchtime.
Not much food trade, the dreich day deterring the dogwalkers and twitchers,
so what hope was there for a pint of Shep’s weakest beer at opening time.
Mudgie must have been smiling down on us, as the bloke who beat me to the bar had just ordered the Master Brew with his fish and chips, and as you’ll know the second pint is 37% chewier than the first out the pump.
Technically, Shepherd Neame are independent, so CAMRA-approved compared to Marston’s, but you wouldn’t know that reading Discourse.
But this was a genuinely good pint, chewy is the word I believe. Mudgie would approve of that glass, too.
retiredmartin 
I’m glad you had a decent pint of Shepherd Neame Master Brew 3.7%. I know it can be pretty good beer if you catch the moment, and as you quite rightly say, the second pint is always better.
I’ve had a pretty good week on traditional bitters, with Black Sheep Bitter in Hawkshead last Sunday (NBSS 4.5); Jennings Castle Bitter in Elterwater on Monday (NBSS 4); the Holts Bitter in Manchester that I mentioned to you the other day (NBSS 5); and then an Acorn Barnsley Bitter in the Bath Hotel yesterday that I had literally just scored as NBSS 4 when the bar manager told me it was slightly cloudy, end of the barrel and he was going to replace it. Honestly, it was really good – he had to rip the pint glass from my resisting fingers. Of course the replacement had to be a 4.5 didn’t it.
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That “lost” 0.5 on the Barnsley will haunt you forever, Will.
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Nothing was lost. I scored them both!
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What punishment does Will receive for scoring a 5?
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It doesn’t appear to be a crime, Dave. Not that I would expect to escape punishment on that basis. Some people think that a 5 is the best you can ever get, and it therefore only happens once in a lifetime. Some scorers go on to refuse to even contemplate scoring a 5, because they expect something better to come along before their time is over. I say phooey to that.
I just score as I find, and if a beer reminds me of a previous beer that I also felt was as good as it gets, I’ll just score it as such. Last year I only had four beers that I rated that highly, out of over 1200 beers scored. So far this year I’ve scored around 1400 beers and I’m on eight scores of 5.
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Will is right, Dave, as on so many things. If you drink something that you can’t imagine being better that’s a 5. It’s an odd scoring system where 3.5 is very good, stay for a second etc.
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It seems odd to have a grade that you can never assign!
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There should be a 4.9 that shows you thought a beer was perfect but were also aware you could never score it as that.
Some branches have an unwritten policy of eliminating 5s and 0s, so the tactical scorer will always go lower.
What’s more important is that Will, and I, are finding so much good cask at the moment.
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And yet restaurants here are nearly always scored 5* or 1*. I remember Matthew Lawrenson rating a meal 4* and getting asked by the place why he hadn’t given them the full marks. “Because nothing is perfect” he said, not unreasonably, but they seemed upset by that !
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“There should be a 4.9 that shows you thought a beer was perfect but were also aware you could never score it as that”.
Yes Martin, only four months to the AGM, in St Albans, so you propose that and I’ll second it !
It’s just as sensible as the quite recent one, defeated, that quarter scores be introduced.
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It’d be easier arguing with a field of sheep than a room full of CAMRAs (present company excepted). I’ll discuss it in the pub with you.
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Martin, seriously though I suggested a simplified alternative of “beer = poor / average / good / excellent / perfect“ but that’s not going to happen.
Some members take NBSS extremely seriously. Recently the member responsible for GBG submissions, the Beer at Heart magazine, branch website and FaceBook resigned from the branch committee after a disagreement about how NBSS scores are used.
and WhatsApp support
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Your suggestion was entirely sensible, Paul. I’m happy to avoid changing a system that essentially works, even if it seems to keep the moaners moaning.
I always say I take beer quality extremely seriously. It’s really important to me that my pints are 3.5 or better, rather than 3, and I’ll always say when a good pub has cask that could be better. I reckon the Bass in Atherstone could be a bit better, if honest, but the pubs themselves are hard to beat. Equally, the Masons Arms in Bury St Edmunds the other month was a dull pub with Greene King IPA approaching nectar. You remember Greene King IPA ? The one that won Champion Beer of Britain in 2004 !
I’m not visiting as many GBG pubs as previously (too many pub crawls like Atherstone), but I am visiting a fair number of new GBG entries of all sorts, and they rarely disappoint. At risk of coming across all Pollyanna this suggests that CAMRA branches get it right in the main.
There’ll always be arguments about GBG inclusion at branch level. It’s the most important thing a branch puts its name to, and it’s hard for some members to accept that old favourites have slipped a bit and been replaced by newcomers.
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“It’s the most important thing a branch puts its name to” but should it be ?
I’ll discuss that in the pub with you, but maybe not till next year.
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“Mrs RM had enjoyed his company on his last Proper Day Out in Atherstone and was equally shocked.”
Alas, as we get older…
“and with foul weather afoot I picked the closest pub,”
It’s funny how we say ‘afoot’. Foul weather usually comes from above so, logically, it should be ‘ahead’.
“the dreich day deterring the dogwalkers and twitchers,”
So, not a braw bricht moonlit nicht, or words to that effect.
“so what hope was there for a pint of Shep’s weakest beer at opening time.”
Good? But, the result would be weak.
“Note : 7% Christmas beer. Mrs RM has her eye on that”
A good ‘eye’ that one!
“and as you’ll know the second pint is 37% than the first out the pump.”
Yes but, 37% what? Frothier, stronger, better?
“But this was a genuinely good pint, chewy is the word I believe.”
Hah! Chewier was the missing word above?
“Mudgie would approve of that glass, too.”
He’s probably discussing that very thing with Alan and Richard.
Cheers
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I went with chewy in the end, Russ (no excuses for that one, Russ, apart from the 3 rapid pints having met a mate in the Sun).
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Heck, your output alone gives you a built-in excuse. But ya, penning prolific pieces of pontification after 3 pints could be a bit of a problem. 😉
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Hey ! Decent bit of alliteration ;-0
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“Hey ! Decent bit of alliteration ;-0”
(takes a bow) 😎
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Untappd is the only place I score beers these days, and if we’re brutally honest, they are influenced by a wide variety of different factors, no matter how objective we try to be.
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My scores are 100% objective and completely correct. But they’re only correct for that particular beer on that particular day, not the other 364 days that folk might visit and score beers.
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Without wishing to extend the debate, on what is really a matter of no huge importance, why does CAMRA get so het up about beer scores? Resigning from the branch committee, at a time when pubs need all the assistance and positive news they can get.
In my day, that was known a throwing a hissy fit, but are you allowed to use such a phrase, these days?
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I think we should appoint Lana as our arbiter of what’s acceptable language.
Hissy fit sounds fine to me.
Agree on fuss over nothing. I think beer quality is very important (but then I feel the same about a Chinese takeaway), but if I enjoy a pint of Harvey’s Sussex and score it a 4, but you say 3.5 and t’other Paul says 4.5 (or excellent) I don’t have a problem. Just as I don’t have any problem with the Good Beer Guide.
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Yes t’other Paul, “Agree on fuss over nothing. Just as I don’t have any problem with the Good Beer Guide” but admitting that I, especially a ‘lifer’, haven’t bought a GBG for several years means that I’m all but finished on that Discourse, not that I’ll miss all the petty minded pendantry.
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I’ll always have a spare, recent copy of the GBG you can have, Paul (either Paul). Unlike most tickers, some of whom are still ticking the 2017 GBG, I throw away all of mine (apart from the one I actually completed, obviously. That will be donated to the National Pub Museum on my death). I’ve kept GBG25 for a while, just in case I have to check what’s changed.
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